This is a guest post from Puddintame. The SCB asked Mr or Ms P to write this column to bring an issue to the public, the treatment of people who attend Seneca County Commissioner meetings. The editors from the SCB may not agree on everything, but we all agree that treating people properly is essential.
“That the issue concerning the fate of our Seneca County Courthouse has been a contentious and controversial one is an understatement. There are those who are staunchly in favor of saving it, those who are rabidly in favor of tearing it down, and those who are trying to base their opinion on fact, research, and the word of the experts, as well as the ability to afford either option.
There has been debate and discussion about this topic in the twice-weekly county commissioners meetings for well onto two years now. Numerous members of the public have gone in to those meetings to voice their concerns and give their input. It has recently been mentioned in this blog that, on occasions, the commissioners have been rude, insulting, and disrespectful towards those members of the public who have asked questions regarding options to save the courthouse. While I, myself, have only been to a few of those meetings, I have been the butt of some of these comments myself. When I asked about the health risks of the dust generated by the demolition of the building, or the asbestos situation, Mr. Sauber stated, “oh, and you’re a doctor?” One person recently brought up the statement made by the commissioners some time back, saying that they looked into grants, etc, for restoring the courthouse. Since anything they’ve done should be a matter of public record, could they provide her with copies of documents that prove they had done so. Mr. Nutter told her that unless she was specific about what papers she wanted copies of, he couldn’t give her anything. The conversation basically went; Citizen: “I’d like to see documentation of any efforts you’ve made to look into grant availability for restoring the courthouse.” Nutter: “Unless you can tell me what you want, I can’t give it to you.” Citizen: “Unless you can show me what you’ve done, how can I ask you for a specific paper, when I don’t know what that might be? I’m looking for any documentation - any paperwork you have on file, anything.” Nutter: “But if you can’t tell me what KIND of documentation, I can’t give you anything.” And around and around it went, with the citizen getting more and more flustered, and Mr. Nutter becoming more and more bemused at her frustration.
Many valuable suggestions and alternative solutions have been presented to the commissioners over the past couple of years, as have been a lot of important and logical questions. Most have been blatantly ignored, or dismissed with derogatory comments. Is this something the general public is aware of? When the commissioners insult those county citizens who raise the concerns of the public, are they insulting not only the people asking the questions, but also the citizenry of this county as a whole? Does the public deserve to be treated this way by their elected officials; and do those who are not in attendance on a regular basis deserve to know how their concerns and thoughts are being received by their elected public servants?
What have been your experiences with the commissioners and their attitudes towards those who would question their motives, opinions, and actions? Should the people know the treatment their fellow citizens are receiving at the hands of the commissioners, to assist the public in making their decisions when the November election rolls around?? And how would you suggest the general public be informed about this issue? “
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I was very disturbed to read this post. In particular, the conversation between the person at the meeting and Nutter and Sauber. Certainly the commissioners should have the information available for the public no matter what side you fall on. If I were commissioner and wanted to prove my case that I had sought grants, I would have a file of grants that I had attempted to gain. Then I could say, yes I tried and here are the results. The whole point is that playing word games and being rude is childish, and unbecoming for an official. If I take the time to attend a public meeting, I expect to be treated with some decorum of respect. I remember a Tiffin school board meeting that was run in much the same manner. Perhaps we should take a cue from another politican and have the Seneca County No BS Express. It doesn’t matter what side of the courthouse you are on, if an elected official can’t act like an adult, they don’t deserve to hold the office.
Many moons ago, I made the comment that we, as a county, ought to look into scrapping the Seneca County Commissioners’ Office in favor of a charter form of government/county managers’ office. My new favorite brother in arms, whose nom de blog is getsomethingdone, was working on getting us the information on how we would “getsomethingdone” like that. It’s long overdue for us to “get ‘r done!” Time to organize, folks!
Hate to be a negative jerk about it, but…. consider the moral track records of those “men in shinning armor!” Most of us know the truth. It’s time to CLEAN HOUSE!
He who is inept, incapable, irresponsible should get the “Heave-Ho!”
It has become a source for embarrassment to admit to people in other communities that we life in Tiffin — of Seneca County. The bumbling of the courthouse issue has made us the laughing-stock of Ohio.
Oh Tubalcain, not to worry. We were a laughing stock long before the courthouse issue. Try saying “Neff” and see the response you get!
Let’s not forget the citizens of this county are getting the raw deal also, from tall grass on county roads to less patrols from the Sheriff’s Office to these wasteful lawyer fees over this courthouse.
And Nutter is raking in pretty good money from the city and county. Does anybody know if the convicted one had a public defender or did he use his county paycheck to pay for his lawyer? What a disgrace either way. Sauber begging to be elected is just terrible.
I did hear invitations’ to Huss for Commissioner party are being sent out via e-mail. Thank Goodness!
Bridinger was represented by private council at his own expense.
I’m sure that if you went to the commissioners office & got a copy of their DVD’s that they record of the meetings, you can see for yourself how the commissioners treat the public.
No matter what side of the courthouse issue one is on, the $64,000 question now becomes, how do we let the public know about this problem? Because you know it’ll never get mentioned in the newspaper - even when things get unbelievably nasty, it barely merits a mention in the next day’s paper.
Do YOU like being represented by someone who has no respect for the public?
Puddintame - To get the word out. Email everyone who lives here with the blog address, and have them email to those in the county.
Also if Huss would like to make her case, she is welcome to email or do a guest post on the blog, as are any other candidates.
I would also contact your representative on the Republican or Democrat Committee and tell them what you think.
Nutter and Sauber are two peas in a pod. Neither can survive in the private sector so they got cushy government jobs by gladhanding to big money in Seneca County. In my opinion if they want to be rude, snotty, and disrespectful like they have been they need to get out of public office and go back to private jobs, where they can pick and choose who they talk to. As an elected official, Mr. Nutter has NO RIGHT TO IGNORE ANY CITIZEN OF SENECA COUNTY, nor does he have the right to be rude to ANYONE. He gave those rights up becoming a PUBLIC SERVANT. And the same goes for Sauber.
And Nutter has been propogating this ridiculous notion that the people didn’t get their vote heard. Ridiculous. THEY DID YOU PINHEAD!!! it was a vote for a new tax which they are not being assesed. The people of the county CANNOT vote to save or tear down the courthouse.
I just despise these two men. They have done more to hurt this county than any two men in the past 50 years.
They say that they speak for the citizens of Seneca County, however, when a citizen tries
to speak on their own behalf and it doesn’t meet
the approval of Nutter and Sauber, that citizen
is berated.
Can’t wait for the unveiling of the SAUBER SIGN one-more-time. He’ll plop it around in an in-your-face program — drag it through the streets, monopolize two parking-slots at the same time, etc. etc., etc.
I’ll do my part to unseat him!
Didn’t Sauber get in trouble over how he’s parking that thing before the primary? If there’s some sort of law or whatever about how one uses/abuses parking spaces, is it being enforced? Or is it only being enforced SELECTIVELY?
The sign also set in plain site in a parking lot near the corner of Jefferson and Riverside for most of last year, and most recently it’s been parked in plain site on Gail Lane. I thought campaign signs could only be displayed for a limited time before elections.
SELECTIVE enforcement is the way-it-is! With our commissioners, ANYTHING is appropriate!
Yes, there is a limit on signs, and for good reason. Driving around town is fine, and even having the sign isn’t bad, but it should not be a year-round exercise in campaigning. That is why God made T-shirts. Speaking of T-shirts, the county prosecutor has been dressing his little girls up in “Egbert for Prosecutor” T-shirts. Guess he is going for the three-year-old vote!
Those who vote for him as Prosecutor demonstrate that level of insight!
If people would have done their homework before they voted maybe some clowns would not have been elected. Many times the most qualified person is not elected because voters do not educate themselves or only vote with their party. We often have ourselves to blame for the wrong people in political offices.
“Forrest Gump” had a classic line about this kind of mentality. I won’t use it here, lest someone take offense.
Someone told me today they talked to someone who talks to Sauber all the time….and that he says he spends as much time OUT of the county as possible during his time off, because he hates all the flack he gets from people, and hates everything that’s going on here.
Do we really want to keep someone in office who doesn’t even seem to like the place or the people? Why run for re-election if that’s the case? Is it easier than finding an honest job, or is he a sucker for punishment?
This seriously bothers me……….
Joe - I have not looked further into the charter form of gov’t cause what I posted previously is all I could find on it (one county out of 88).
I will take up the law enforcement ?’s on the parking issues and direct you to the online version of the City Ordinances http://www.conwaygreene.com/tiffin.htm
City ordinance covers this only in the public parking of it.
First issue of it being parked at the corner of Jefferson St. and Riverside Dr. That particular parking lot is private property so UNLESS the owner of the parking lot called and complained the PD cannot ticket it as an abandoned vehicle.
As long as it is properly plated and current expiration then it is not a junk vehicle as defined in the code.
The PD cannot and does not enforce campaign law violations so as far as it being displayed year round or way before the City ordinance of (1195.02(m)) which states that TEMPORARY signs can be put out 6 weeks prior to the election and no more than 5 days after and such signs will not exceed 20 sq. feet in area. (This would need to be reported to board of elections or whoever is in charge of campaign law violations possibly the state???) Although the PD will enforce the city ordinance that states that NO signage will be put in the stree boulevard area (area between street curb or edge of street to the sidewalk). So any signs placed in this area will be removed.
Now as to the public parking of the trailer on city streets, 351.16 Parking Within Marked Lines would seem to address this issue but if you read the ord. it only says that the wheels of the vehicle have to be within the painted lines. No where does it say you can’t take up two spaces because of a trailer attached to your vehicle, again, only that the wheels are within the lines.
So as long as the truck and the trailer tires are within the lines then it appears, under this ord., that would be okay and no violation. (maybe one of the young new council persons will sew up this loophole and amend the ordinance with a new subsection).
351.10(b) states: “No truck (except a pickup truck), trailer, semi-trailer, commercial tractor or any vehicle having a greater width than seven feet shall be parked on any street, alley, street lawn area, boulevard or berm except in the case of an emergency or while actually loading and unloading, or if such vehicle is not being loaded or unloaded for a length of time greater than one hour in any period of twenty-four hours. ”
So this seems to be the ordinance to use, however, the last line states that as long as it is not greater than one hour in any 24hr period then it would seem to appear that he can do so as there appears to be no other provision preventing him from doing so (other than public opinion). So to actually see it, note the time, come back in an hour, ticket it at that time, is going to be a huge time constraint to try to concentrate on one person.
Thank you, get!
It still boils down to the lack of respect that this politician has for the general public. We all know that parking is at a premium in downtown Tiffin. We also know that the parking enforcement officer for the City of Tiffin, complete with the scowl on his face, tickets everyone else for even de minimus violations, so it becomes all the more galling when a guy and a trailer with a political sign on top completely hogs two spots for no reason other than self-promotion.
He shall NOT receive my vote.
I do have a question of my own. I read in the AT yesterday, July 11th and I will quote:
“Nutter said he has discussed with Gov. Ted Strickland’s chief of staff the idea the state still might provide up to $2 million for a renovation project. Nutter said it was his understanding money from the state was no longer available because voters defeated a ballot issue during the March primary.”
Then today I read this:
“On Friday, the governor’s office confirmed John Haseley, Strickland’s chief of staff, talked to Seneca County Commissioner Ben Nutter and asked to be notified before any demolition occurs in order for Strickland’s office to explore all preservation possibilities.
“The governor’s office believes this is an important landmark for the county. He (Strickland) has said he believes that preserving the courthouse is preferable. The governor and his office are continuing to work with local communities; other options and ideas will be discussed as conversation continues,” said Keith Dailey, press secretary for Strickland.
The question is two-fold; First, is this just a big word game back and forth and secondly, how can you say that it is your understanding that the money is no longer there and that same day we are told that the Governor’s Office wants to explore all opportunities???
Remember the whole sequence in Monty Python’s “Holy Grail” where they do the witch hunt? Sometimes I think the commissioners stretch their position to the same extent as it relates to their quest to demolish the courthouse.
“She’s a witch!”
“Prove it”
“She turned me into a newt!”
“You don’t look like a newt!”
“Well…I got better…”
To be fair, many people obviously want the courthouse to be destroyed. However, the way the commissioners are going about it reminds me of Tim Conway and Don Knotts in the “Apple Dumpling Gang.”
I agree, I didn’t mean to imply that the PD should look the other way whether it is the parking officer or regular officers. I just meant that to actually see it, note or chalk tires, come back after an hour, and ticket it may not be in the scheme of what else is going on at the time. Alot of resources to try to monitor one person for a small violation in the great scheme of things.
I certainly agree that it appears to be in bad taste to haul it EVERYWHERE and if I ran for office would not be so blatant about it but the problem is that since he got elected that way and won a primary that way maybe he thinks that is what won it for him so he will continue to skirt the law loophole.
So maybe the parking issue isn’t the big thing to go after, what about the issue of it being 6 weeks prior? Why wouldn’t you just use a tarp to cover it up until the time period says you can have it out???
Ahhh two of my favorite movies but from both ends of the viewing spectrum. Nice analogy’s Joe, thanks for the chuckles…..
Joe - but who is the 3rd commish, the late Harvey Korman? He wasn’t in the movie so maybe we should say they are acting more like the Larry, Curly and Moe in pick a movie that they were in.
Or better yet, to stick with the Harvey Korman theme, maybe they are more like the town Elders in Blazing Saddles???? That would make the governor Mel Brooks.
Oh, Oh….better yet they are more like the Lion, Tinman, and Scarecrow in that they are searching for a heart, brains, and courage.
gawddarnit….see what you all have done….you got me casting my lot in with the naysayers…..
I don’t want to be mean so I will just say that everyone has positives and negatives so hope they are thick skinned….
get - how about we say this about them. Typical politicians, doing what is right for them, instead of the people they represent.
The Lion, Tinman, and Scarecrow would have never ridiculed people in public meetings.
What we need is someone like Toto, who pulled back the curtain and revealed the Wizard for what he really was. Remember what he told Dorothy and Company: Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.
And then there was Elvira Gulch, aka “The Wicked Witch,” who owned half the county and tried to rub-out poor little Toto.
My photoshop finger is twitching.
Hey Scout: Imagine the possibilities!!!! I am laughing so hard.
This one is going to take some thought. I want to capture the essence of it all.
Let’s see: The Scarecrow was afraid of “fire,” the Tin-man was afraid of the rain (oil can), and the Lion was afraid of Toto.
The Yellow Brick Road has to be the proposed Super-Two highway.
Speaking of disrespect, don’t forget those grumpy old trees that pelted Dorothy and friends with apples.
…and, how do the flying monkeys factor into the story, and the “horse of a different color?” Then there’s the Wizard’s balloon, and I can think of a couple of ideas for the tornado.
speak - do you have photoshop?
Don’t count out Glenda “the Good Witch”!!!!!
Scout: I have a version of it, but I’m not too good at it yet.
The “ruby slippers” are a metaphor for the Governor’s $2 million. The money’s always been there, Ben Nutter just didn’t know it. The Wizard’s balloon is a metaphor for the last bond issue that sailed away, which Nutter and Sauber wanted us to believe was the last chance to save the courthouse. I don’t know who Glenda is, but she’s about to fly in, and show us the answer.
I just saw a women with a “star on a stick” headed to the commissioners’ office.
Dorothy is a metaphor for the courthouse. In other words the statue of “Lady Justice” in a pair of ruby shippers.
That’s slippers, you silly goose!!!!
Does this make all the citizens of Seneca County nothing more than a bunch of Munchkins?
Hey, Pud — you are surely on to something! So long as the citizens of Seneca County wear blinders when they enter the polling booth while wearing blinders. “Bunch of Munchkins” is an apt term!